Achieving a Mingjue State with Qigong - Cynthia Li

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In today’s Qigong podcast, Cynthia Li explores the depth of Zhineng Qigong and how the Mingjue state can be fully integrated into daily life. Moving beyond the structure of traditional Qigong practice, she emphasizes that true healing begins when consciousness becomes self-aware—when we observe not just our thoughts and Qi, but the awareness itself. Through consistent observation, Cynthia encourages practitioners to merge with the information field, allowing the subtle intelligence of the Qi field to guide transformation from within. This practice isn’t just about moments on the mat; it’s about sustaining the Mingjue state during life’s everyday challenges.

By grounding Qigong in daily routines, whether through Lower Dantian breathing, La Qi, or simply being present while washing dishes, Cynthia demonstrates how we can bring heart intelligence and self-awareness into everything we do. Her approach to Mingjue daily life is both practical and profound, using comfortably challenging scenarios and incremental exposure to strengthen awareness in real-world situations. She highlights how emotional flow, letting go of resistance, and releasing attachment are not just side effects of practice, they are the signs of true Qigong integration. Through this lens, Qigong becomes not an escape, but a playful, empowering, and joyful way to live.

Join Cynthia Li as she explains how to achieve a Mingjue State with Qigong!

Mindful Moments: 

• Qigong is most powerful when integrated into daily life, not limited to practice sessions.
• The Mingjue state in Qigong is a form of deep self-awareness and observation.
• Healing in Qigong begins with consciousness, not just physical movement.
• Qigong helps release resistance and emotional blockages by cultivating inner observation.
• Practicing Qigong in daily activities brings heart intelligence into ordinary moments.
• Qigong is not an escape—it’s a tool to transform how we live and respond.
• The Qigong information field holds wisdom that supports healing and personal growth.
• Group Qigong practice can amplify the Mingjue field through shared consciousness.
• Playfulness and joy are essential parts of a balanced Qigong lifestyle.
• True empowerment in Qigong comes from practicing awareness in real-life situations.

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Transcript

The word Mingjue is comprised of Ming, which means pure, clear, and Jue, which means active observation. When practicing Mingjue, we are actually in a state of awareness where our consciousness is aware of itself. If you are as confused now as I am, then you might be wondering how does that show up in daily life?

And this is what today's episode with Cynthia Li is all about. My name is Torsten Lüddecke and this is the Wisdom Qigong Podcast.

Hello everyone and welcome to another episode of the Wisdom Qigong podcast. My guest today is Cynthia Li. And Cynthia is, uh, a very well known Ang Qigong teacher in the community. She's working very closely with Teacher Wei, and she's also the editor of, uh, one of his books on the mingjue, the Mingjue Awakening.

Uh, you'll find the link in the show notes if you're interested in this book, and when I approached. Yeah, I said, she said, well, why don't we talk about how to integrate mingjue in daily life? And I think, you know, before we start, uh, Cynthia, maybe we'll briefly explain what is mingjue actually. Mm-hmm. Uh, mingjue is uh, two Chinese characters, right?

Ming is like pure, clear, uh, jue is observation or the act of observing. So, you know, um, sometimes we, we paraphrase it by saying it's pure consciousness. Um, it's a state of awareness where your consciousness is aware of itself. And so it's, you know, I sometimes I'll explain it as sort of like a meta level of awareness, right?

So there's, we can be aware of our surroundings, we can be aware. As Qigong practitioners, we can be aware of our Qi universe. Our two bodies and then this is, okay, now we are aware that we are the awareness. So that's Mingjue. Mingjue is the awareness that, um, you know, observes itself and also is observing and, um, merging with other consciousnesses to really, um.

Collectively awaken the Qi universe that we, we live and breathe in. So why is this, uh, so important and so meaningful? Uh, to me personally, or more Yes, please. Me personally, I mean, I, you know, just by way of background, I am a, um, Western trained medical doctor in California. And, um. Came to zhineng qigong, and then mingjue, you know, as a more specific Right.

Practice within zhineng qigong, even though it's completely one and the same. Um, but a deeper practice, I guess. I, I didn't, beyond the movements, beyond the qi, uh, it took me several years right before I, I actually understood, oh, the primary practice is consciousness and why is that so important? Why is it so revolutionary?

And. You know, I came to Qigong because of, uh, very complex autoimmune conditions that I had, was very debilitated. My own field had nothing to offer. And so, you know, like many people, right out of desperation would try anything. So, um, uh, you know, I began as a rehabilitation exercise. It was very body based and then, oh, okay.

Oh, there's, there's actually more, more to it. There's subtle, realms of qi and then. And then came mingjue, this is about five years ago now, and it was a completely different way for me to practice. Qigong. And you know, and as I've gotten to know a lot of people in the community, it's been a game changer for them too.

You know, some people who've been practicing longer than I have. So, um, I would say the, you know, at least in the theory, which, uh, you have also beautifully displayed on your, on your website, you know, in sort of parsing out some of the theories, the teachings is that there are three, everything is Qi and there are three levels, right, of different.

Uh, gradations of subtlety and, and roughness or density, um, depending on the, the framing. And so, you know, first you have the, the material level, you know, the physical body, the flesh, the cells, the atoms. And then you go to the, what we would normally call energy or qi, which is kind of this energy level, right?

And then it goes all the way down to the quantum, and then you have the subtlest subtlest level, uh, which is information I. Consciousness, our consciousness is, uh, resides within this, this dimension. So it's super, super subtle, but it's subtlety means that it permeates everything. And so everything, like, and as a doctor, right, I'm, I work with a lot of people who want to heal their, their health conditions and make their bodies stronger.

And so I did not recognize the, the power. Consciousness. So the teaching right, um, in, in zhineng qigong is that, yeah, if you change consciousness and consciousness merges with the qi body, it transforms the physical body, right? Sort of inside out, bottom up. Um, and so then you add mingjue drag collective field, which is another game changer.

It's another level where. As consciousnesses as hearts, we can merge, right? Because that energy, that field is so subtle, we merge, we don't merge on the physical level, right? That's, that's when we fuse identities, that's when co-dependencies happen. All sorts of things happen on that level. But when we merge at the consciousness and heart levels, um.

That wisdom and that I'll say the information field that's there, we can bring that into our bodies. And so it's literally like, you know, bringing in, yeah. The love and wisdom of Dr. Pang, you know, or teacher Wei, all the other teachers who've come before us who are here now, all of our community, and allowing that to harmonize our own energy fields.

So, you know, and as a, as a, um, scientist too, you know, we know now that there are, there are measurable energy fields within our bodies, and these are the denser fields, the, the electromagnetic fields. And it's usually when we're practicing what we feel, the bodily Qi, right? So, um, but know all of this information, this conscious information.

Can help us harmonize those fields. And then when those fields within us are harmonized our cells, they function optimally. And so healing can happen very, very quickly. And so, you know, it was, it's been interesting for me to try to even begin to understand, oh, how is it that these quote miraculous healings happen?

How do they happen? And so now I have a, at least a some sense, you know, at least energetically and informationally how that happens. I'd like to come back to one point you just mentioned because, um, when you said that, uh, if you tap into the bja and into the collective, uh, field, it is that you are connecting with the information and the wisdom, you know, of all the other practitioners and people like Dr.

Pang and so on. And, um, and I'm just, you know, uh. Excited because I, uh, only today I listened to a podcast about artificial intelligence. And, uh, in this podcast it was pointed out that, for example, if you have, um, uh, um, um, what's called Humanic robot, uh, if one learns something, then automatically everybody else has the same learning, and they pointed up.

That this is something extraordinary in artificial intelligence, which is beyond human capacity. But really what you are saying and what a lot of us have already experienced ourselves is that is actually not true. We can basically tap into the same resource now by using our consciousness and by using the ENG and by using the um, uh, the Minjgue state so we can actually tap into all this information.

And, uh, that is the information that we need. Uh, because in this information field, we have the right, um, uh, knowledge and wisdom of what it means to be healthy. So if we connect with that, you know, we automatically can go back into a healthy state. Uh, is, that's, if that's, you know, correct what I'm saying here.

I mean, it's, it's interesting that you bring up ai, you know, and I, I don't purport to be an AI expert by any means. My, my understanding, so in, in Chinese Shing, the, the character Shing actually means. Mind and heart, right? So in, in, in the, in western languages, we've, we've divided those up. They're fragments.

And so even saying like sort of heart mind is, is not quite true, right? To the original essence of that word. Um, and the original essence of that information behind that word. And so, but being a, a body, you know, with a brain, with a heart, my understanding is that. What we humans have actually that's different than AI is we have heart intelligence.

And so when we, when we connect, uh, consciousness, you know, Mingjue, it's. We use the term consciousness, but it's a, it's a heart to heart connection. And again, we have, um, kind of, you know, emerging neuroscience that, that actually confirms that, is that the heart actually sends more information to the brain than the brain sends to the heart.

So the heart is act, and the heart's feel is much bigger energetically than the brains feel, at least in humans. And so. When we're really connecting MRE to mre, it's, my understanding is it's a heart field and, um, that through the heart we receive this information, filters up through to the brain and then, you know, we call that consciousness.

So, but really consciousness is the brain, heart, right together as one. And that's what is different than ai, ai. Hmm. And not have heart intelligence. It just, design by design does not. But in terms of mental intelligence, it, it can be a tremendous tool for elevating consciousness. Um, it can, you know, it can also be incredibly dangerous, right.

As well. So it's, it's, it's like any other kind of source of information, right? If we always come back to ourselves, we always connect to our heart and then, um. Connect to this massive field that can help stabilize us and where we're receiving this intuitive information all the time, we can use right that information.

Mingjue uses the AI information I. Freely and to enhance itself to awaken more to itself. So it's a very powerful tool and what AI can do mentally. I'm a human, it's just, it's impossible for us to compute that fast. So it is this very interesting time, uh, where, you know, where we're also, I think really transforming our understanding of what intelligence is.

Because there's differences between heart and and mind intelligence. And I would of course would like to know, because that's how, where we started the conversation of where and how you implement this in your daily life. I mean, what does it mean for you when you wake up in the morning or when you go through your day and uh, yeah.

How do you implement that? Yeah. So, you know, I began, um, very organically, I began this series, uh, in our community, um, two or three years ago, just called, you know, Mingjue Daily Life. And I was working initially with small QI groups and then, um, and then it kind of expanded to the US and then now, you know, um, I mean it's really, it's opened to anybody, um, around the world.

And it became, it, it arose because, um, I began to see in my own life. Wow. You know what? There's some and, and not just for me, but also people around me, right? Some in incredible teachers and healers that have been, you know, we've been studying alongside each other for years and then now there's this new community and whoa, they're going fu is incredible.

And, you know, in the Mingjue practice, you know, as, as you know now as well, right? Can, so oftentimes it can put you into a trance state, right? Like there's, like, there's different levels of Mingjue state and of this peacefulness, of this coherence, of this harmony. And, you know, in a very deep state, you're kind of in a trance, oh, like a hypnotic state.

And then, but you can also be in Mingjue state. Deeply observant state in, in waking, you know, waking ordinary life. It's very different than thinking, right? And so we know that it puts you in a different brainwave state. So, um, so I knew the science on it, and then I also knew just as a, as a human being trying to live my life, I'd be like, oh my God, we're in such a great state during practice.

And then daily life, you know, a relationships and work and, you know, uh, societal stuff, political, I mean, all of that. And then it would just kind of go, you know, just go by the wayside. It was like, wait a minute, where's re here? And right, because just as we were talking about earlier, right, mingjue information conscious is that subtle level of information of energy and it's, it's so difficult to connect to.

Be in a very material, loud, fast, you know, uh, high stimulus environment. So what I began to realize was, you know, if you can imagine like a fork in the road, right? Is that we begin to practice, practice, practice, and then our gong fu in our practices become so strong and we're not integrating it. That, that it's, that fork grows wider and wider.

So then when. So then our practice becomes more of a retreat and an escape more than a tool for completely transforming our lives and our health. Right? So that was when I had that realization, I was like, wow. Because what I began to experience in my own body was more in the form of resistance. And, uh, I could just feel the resistance in ma in daily life.

And that became a teacher, right? It was like, okay, mingjue is there, who's observing this resistance? Mingjue is observing it. Okay? Then Mingjue is here. mingjue is always here. So, uh, I just began to practice and play. Um, the other, the other inspiration, if you'll call it for mingjue , daily life as a practice was. Um, I was, uh, there was a period of time when I was having very intense qi purifications after chi purification, and it was difficult for me to even find a chance to sort of like re rebound and recover and live my life.

And so, um, teacher Wei said, you know, oh, you know, okay, why don't you take a break from the dedicated practices? But practice mingjue awareness in your daily life. You know? So just, you can just tone it down a little bit, but begin to integrate it, you know, don't, don't stop, you know, do lower Dante breathing as you're living your life.

You know, do lower Dante breathing. You know, right now you and I are talking, I'm doing lower damp breathing, you know, after years of training, right? So it's like. More and more. Oh, Mingjue became the master of daily life, and it wasn't just about the practice during dedicated sessions, and so it tr actually transformed my life because it made my life much more playful, right?

Everything, every challenge felt like, ah, okay. How's Mingjue respond to that? As opposed to like, oh my gosh, you know, another, you know, another health challenge, another relationship difficulty. I mean, what you name it, right? Or whatever's happening on the world stage in America and the world. So, um, it just made, there was a lightness to my days and a lightness to my relationships and my health actually has been really, really.

You know, remarkably resilient. I mean, I still have blips, you know, and challenges and definitely qi purifications. Uh, but I can move through those with so much more flow. Um, so yeah, so mean joint, daily life is really about recognizing, you know, I mean, to your point about ai, whether it's ai, whether it's cleaning our toilets, you know, whether it's cooking dinner, whether it's our work.

Everything is like a playground for mingjue to observe itself, to awaken more to itself, to awaken to the abundance of life. And I think this is, uh, such an important point because I, I, you know, the moment you said that, that, that you, that you felt that the dedicated exercise become an escape. Rather than a transformational thing that, that you, that becomes who you are.

Um, yeah. I I, I, it immediately hit me because there's so many people, um, you know, that ideally love and that are making such an effort with Qigong. Uh, but I think this is exactly what's happening to them. That's exactly what's happening. They, they, they're kind of. Becoming dependent nearly on these sessions, uh, on the wisdom of a, a teacher and, and stuff, because they are, they're separating their daily lives from this experience.

And it is like a, you know, I don't wanna say drug, but you know what I mean, when I, when I said it, it, it becomes, yeah. Right. So, uh, and, and that is not what you want because that is not the idea neither of zhineng qigong nor the mingjue, nor of any, any spiritual movement, I suppose. Um, it, it should not be the escape route.

It should be the, the tool. for, you do everyday life. Four, uh, how you go through life. And so I think you're really hitting, um, uh, the nail on the head here with your, with your, with your thoughts, with your work, um, to, uh, to, to tackle exactly that question. And, um, and if I understand you correctly, I'm trying to summarize a little bit here because, uh, for me, uh, I need to just make sure I follow what you're saying.

Uh, this is a, has a lot to do with. Being aware all day, because when, no matter what happens, the way you interact with it, the way um, you deal with it is, and we start asking yourself the question, okay, how would Mingjue, how does Mingjue deal with it? Rather than going, uh, into the actual. Mishap or uh, uh, external thing that's happening.

Uh, you, you, but you need an awareness for that in order to, uh, react from that point of Mingjue rather than react from our beliefs or frame of reference or whatever we usually would take, uh, when yeah. Where we go through your daily life. Is that so? Yes and yes. And what I would clarify is that, uh, you know.

When we think like, oh, how would Ingre respond that, that's already our thinking mind. Right? That's not Mingjue So I just wanted to make that point because it's very easy for our thinking minds to, to think that we're doing ingre. But re is first and foremost a practice of observation. So we, it's like we return, we were right, we retract back to that.

At the center of our heads, the JI Palace, and we observe from that place. So there, there has to be a pause, there has to be a, a pause to observe, right? And then Mingjue uses, right? The reference framework, including our sensory organs, including what we're seeing to then, okay, how do we interact right with reality, with, with our lives.

And so what I do in these workshops is I, again, they're just playful experiments, but. I will, uh, like, we'll, we'll just say, okay, hey, you know what? We're gonna invite people into a lower dentine breathing, or it's usually correlated with our, with whatever teacher weigh is teaching, right? So maybe it's making the mm sound, maybe it's the shoe sound.

It's, anyways, it's, it varies. And so, okay. Very, very brief practice, right? Because I'm like, okay, we're in daily life. Like this is not a, you know, 15 minute field setting thing. So, okay. Come into this place you've been practicing. You can come back to yourself in a very, very, you know, shorter and shorter time.

Right. And then we will play with either the, the surroundings of their room experiencing, you know, how do you experience it, how do you observe it as a qi. Room and it, and all the empty spaces around you teaming with Qi. You know, it's not just air, it's not just negative space, it's actually, it's positive space.

Teaming with qi teaming with love information. Right. And how does that transform your experience? Just walking around your room? So it can be something like that or, um, I use images and so, uh, the images, um, can be. Challenging, right? So, so we're practicing, let's say La Qi, right? We're doing La Qi and connecting to our breath Ming drills, practicing lachy, and then there'll be an image.

Of like a scene of nature, right? And so, okay. Oh yeah, okay, this is good. This is, I got it. You know, and then kind of incrementally increasing the senses, right? It's like, okay, we're gonna introduce some movement. And so there's a video of someone walking through nature, you know? And then, okay, maybe we're gonna add sound.

You know, somebody, there's birds flying, you know, and chirping and just, you know, as you increase the sensory fullness. Of that, it's easier and easier, right? To lose Mingjue because we're just, we lose ourselves. And so there's an incremental practice, um, where we, oh, okay. Oh wow, I really lost myself there.

Um, and then there's like images that are challenging, right? It's like a doctor on a video conference who's talking to you, right? A lot of people get triggered by that, but it's like, Hey, first off. Where first, and you know, and I always say if anything's really, really triggering, like just close your eyes, come back to yourself.

Right. But this is an incremental practice and it's safe and we're collectively practicing. So you're aware that you're not just doing it by yourself and uh, right. And this is how we practice for real life. Like, you know, oh, this is hard. If this is hard, you keep practicing here because then when you go into your doctor's actual office, you're gonna be much more.

Rehearsed and prepared. Andrea has been practicing and training for this. Um, and then there are also things that are really pleasant, you know, like puppies and like, you know, um, children playing and things that we love, right? So. Observing our attachments right to that, can we observe them as qi realities, you know, losing the form, losing the identity, staying centered, you know, with La Qi or lower Dante breathing.

And so it, we begin to just literally. Right With the interfaces of life, of daily life of a messy living room. You know, it can be any of those things, um, while we are practicing and then while it's in a safe space, and then we incrementally go. And so like the incremental stuff is, you know, is stuff that I've learned from my medical background, right?

Where we, when we work with people with trauma is like, oh, you incrementally expose, you know, and in Qigong, right? And zhineng qigong, there's that. Phrase comfortably challenging. They're talking about the same thing. They're talking about an incremental zone where we do need the challenge if we're too comfortable, you know, just like in dedicated practice, if we're so comfortable there, it's great, but there's not a lot happening in terms of change and healing, right?

And growth. So, um, we wanna find that sweet spot where it's not so triggering to where, you know, people can't recover and it just becomes like another frozen state. I. Um, and then yet it's challenging so that we begin to transform those places where we have resistance. So when I look at your, what you are offering is that, um.

Is that open to the general public? You know, regular Ang go students can they just join your session? Uh, okay, great. So if I put your website, uh, in the show notes, then people know how to find you. They can connect, they can attend the sessions, uh, participate in your group, in your group sessions, and, uh, learn more about that and learn these tools now.

But it's still, um, if I may say so, it's still a training session, Oh, it's definitely a training session. It's not a practice session, right? Where like one teacher is guiding the practice. It's, and I, I say that, I say, you know, I'm your guide and I'm practicing with you. And if we have 50 people, if we have two people, like if we have a hundred people, there are that many different practices going on, right?

Because we all have different. Areas where we have resistance and we all relate to these images or whatever practice it is, uh, differently. And so there's also, the feedback at the end is, is always very rich because it is, it's like, oh, this really, you know, this really triggered me. I was really surprised, you know, just an image of this on a laptop, you know, really triggered me or.

And you know, and the challenges come up a lot, but, but more and more now, it's like the affections. It's like. Oh my God, you, I, that really got me, you know, I can, I can deal with the challenges and I know, okay, Mingjue, you know, challenge, but oh my god, my attachments to the things I love, you know, and what do I do with that?

You know, why do we need to let that go? And it's like, well, you don't need to let it go. It's not that it's quote bad, it's the, the attachment to it. The strong emotional attachment, again, blocks flow. It blocks openness. It creates resistance because we don't wanna let go. So in fact, the paradox is if we can let that go, we actually love more unconditionally.

We don't have fear, we don't have grief, you know, grief, any of these, uh, you anger, whatever it is. And so we can experience any of those, any of those emotions as well, but in a very flowing state. So if the anger comes up, it just flows right out. Grief flows right out. So none of them become contracted energies.

They're just flowing. And so the, the experience of being human actually becomes much more abundant. You know, some people have this, they say, whoa, we kind of become again robots. You know, we kind of become emotionless. I was like, Hmm, no, it's actually the opposite. It's the opposite. Uh, and the difference is that we're not enslaved by these emotions, right?

We're not enslaved by these attachments to identity. So we become in a very, very free relationship. And again, it's another way to say it is just Mingjue relationships. It, how do we relate to our symptoms, our health, our body? How do we relate to our world, our, you know, the people in it. So it's really like.

How do we relate to our emotions? So in just much more freedom, much more play. And so what I've really appreciated, you know, about this course with Teacher Wei and and the field is, um, and really how it's transformed my life is this playfulness is like, you know, people think, oh my God, mingjue consciousness, you know, spirituality and awakening.

And there's just a joy. There's a real joy to it. Um, and so that's the mingjue joy, right? That's free from, there's no reason for the joy. It's just joy. Yeah. Um, joy for the sake of joy. Joy for the sake of being alive. Um, so. Yeah, so, so it's really just my, you know, that that workshop is, is just a small offering, but it's a, it's a way that I get to play, that I get to, uh, my Mingjue gets to continue to evolve as well, um, together with everyone else's.

And so it's, it's powerful for me to see how people are using these tools to, to awaken. Was a beau. I think it's a beautiful offering that you're having there. And I also want to thank you for all the beautiful words that you've shared with us today. Uh, has, I think it has greatly shed some insights into what does zhineng qigong really mean and, uh, what does it mean to.

To overcome the, uh, the, the actual trailing setting and go into your real life and, uh, be that person that we actually are. Uh, and I think the work that you're doing there is fantastic. And, uh, I want to thank you for Yeah, for the contribution and the podcast as well. And I hope that many, many people have been inspired by what you had to say.

Hmm. Thank you. And the gratitude goes both ways and I'm, I'm so grateful for your being and doing in the world. I.